M4 AEG w/ recoil/blowback suggestions, help!
 

Hey guys, I recently caught the airsoft bug.. again.
I've been always interested in airsoft since its humble beginnings in my area. I am happy to report that all my paintball fields in my area now have airsoft days! Boy has airsoft come along way in the past decade.

I am very interested in customization, realism, so all metal, authentic looking, reliability, sounds good, shoots far and accurate, recoil or some kind of blowblack.

My gun of choice would be a M4. Tactical and customizable as possible.

Some suggestion I have found from other posts:

KWA RM4A1 Electric Recoil Gun $375.00 CAD
I love this guns feature set: having the lock bolt function when you run out of BB's is so appealing to me because it adds so much realism. Also to be able to select 30 BB's or 60 BB shots per mag makes me happy too and the icing on the cake is you can use regular mags as well. A very hard contender imo, anyone have any experience or second hand opinions of this gun?

BOLT M4 Bolt Recoil Shock System $549.00 CAD
No bolt-lock functionality but apparently has satisfying 'recoil'

BOLT M4 KEYMOD COBRA $494.10 CAD
B4KEYCOBRA realistic bolt movement just like a GBBS. Just no bolt lock feature :(
https://youtu.be/Pj6q3rn9hUY?t=39s

G&P M4 GP-FRS001 Free Float Recoil System Gun $337.20 CAD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYhdPKNHUrg

Tokyo Marui M4 SOPMOD $729.00 CAD
Tokyo Marui TM-M4A1-SOCOM Recoil Shock $729.00 CAD
Like the KWA ERG M4 these guns also has the lock-bolt function and a selectable 30 rounds or 82. But holy crap these guns sound great in full auto!

GBLS DAS M4A1 $1000+ CAD
Shell Eject and feature a bolt lock functionality.

TOP M4A1 EBBR $750+ CAD
Shell Eject and feature a bolt lock functionality.

The BO-Dynamics/Lonex BAW-R $360-450 CAD
Kicks a lot like a GBBR but it does not feature a bolt lock/release.
https://youtu.be/yswP6J5ag2U?t=6s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4XrbW58SI0

Lonex Recoil M4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJqFDDN5G4Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdJhySdaqLI

Lancer Tactical MMC $296.95 CAD
Lancer Tactical MMC is just a rebrand of the BO-Dynamics/Lonex BAW-R. Looks like it has comparable recoil to a gbbr, more than a STOCK Tippman M4 from what users and youtubers have said.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HpxmF-7lb0
http://www.torontoairsoft.com/Lancer...EL_p_4571.html

G&D DTW M4
PTW clone.

NEW

KWA VM4A1
AEG2.5 platform, out now $311.95 CAD (direct usd to cad conversion off the kwa usa site, so no duty fees/shipping fees included in this price)
KWA RM4A1
AEG3 platform, coming Spring 2017
PTS CA C40
AEG3 platform, coming Fall 2017


Bolt vs KWA vs Lonex vs Tokyo Marui Recoil Systems
That is all I could find for now, if anyone has any other suggestions I am all ears. I should be only spending $350 but if I have to spend $450-$500 I will, I might look for one used.
Please I would love to hear opinions on these rifles. Thanks guys!

Here is a list of EBBR Systems:

http://airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=173245

The Bolt M4 has a good amount of kick and is more is is capable of upgrading than the KWA ERG.

The KWA ERG, GBLS DAS M4A1, TOP M4A1 EBBR Shell Eject and the TM EBBRs feature a bolt lock functionality.

TM EBBRS and the GBLS DAS M4A1 are expensive.

The G&P Free Float Recoil System is nothing special.

The TM Recoil Shock and the KWA ERG require special magazine to utilize the bolt lock/bolt release feature.

The BO-Dynamics/Lonex BAW-R kicks a lot like a GBBR but it does not feature a bolt lock/release.

If you want blowback, go gbbr.
In an aeg, its just one more thing to break down.

ebb doesn't really blow back in any way.. it just moves.. or shakes... or vibrates.

I like thing that vibrates ;)

On a serious note, I would go with the RM4A1, the new ones are rear wired, and the bolt function is cool.

Marui has it's magic, but it's very over priced... I only know one crazy person here on ASC that has 3-4 of them *cough brock0*

I like the KWA ERG, but I will never buy another KWA gun as the company has terrible customer service. I will also tell anyone who will listen about my terrible experience with them.

Although the recoil is weak, it is still enough that you need to adjust for it. I really like the feature in the mags where it stops shooting as well. But once again... caveat emptor with KWA.

Best bang for buck is the RM4 as it has all the features such as recoil, bolt stop and so on and is decent out the box, get the RM4A1 if you can. Most of the RM4 gearbox and barrel set is upgrade able though there are a number of proprietary parts that you need to work around.

Increasing the spring strength would also increase the felt recoil, as long as the springs you are changing are linear. Non linear springs would decrease the felt recoil by a significant amount.

Some people have problems with cracked receivers, ive only seen it with the old PTS RM4 models however. I have a PTS RM4 but the body feels fine to me with no cracks even though ive gamed it pretty hard and have taken it apart hundreds of times by now. Id imagine they might have fixed it with the new RM4A1 as the body has been changed.

This is great info thank you. I've added it to the list.

I don't have any experience with GBB.
How much maintenance will I be doing compared to AEG?
How many rounds can you fire off with one mag before you notice a drop in performance?

Ok looks like the KWS RM4 ERG is a top contender right now for me.
Price is great and great features.
I wonder how upgradable and customizable it is.
I am curious how much faster the recoil effect drains the battery.

I am trying out weigh the pros and cons of AEG vs GBB
How much more maintenance is GBB? If its neglected what would happen?
How is the performance and range of GBB compared to AEG?
How many rounds can you fire off before the pressure starts to drop and becomes noticeable?

Also have you guys heard any about PTW systems and PTW clones. Are there any PTW clones under $1000?

Appreciate these answers thanks!

GBB will cost a bit, since mags are 40-70 each, the gun itself you'll need a reliable one like a GHK IMO for cold weather play, else WE runs fine in warmer climates.

Anyways tons of threads on gbb vs aeg. If it's your first gun, I would get an AEG first.

GBB vs AEG

https://www.reddit.com/r/airsoft/com..._aeg_or_a_gbb/

http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=154569

http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=166047

http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=97307

More great info thanks. Ok seems to me these points are preventing me from getting a GBB:
-Price of gun and mags (but you get more realism in the design and more quality correct?)
-30-70 round mags (I dont mind this because it adds more realism but at least with ERG you have the option of 30rd mags or high capacity mags)
-Gas doesn't preform well in the cold (from what I gather they start sucking under 10c depending on the setup. Vancouver's climate drops under 10c for at least 3 months out of the year. But thats usually the time I switch to skiing. We also have a indoor airsoft facility close by so I can switch to CQB in the winter.)
-In terms of maintenance I don't mind learning and researching how to properly maintain a GBB, thats part of the fun for me.
-Skirmishing off against AEGs with high caps and people that spray and pray (which makes these guns only good for milsim games, CQB or games where ammo is locked)

Are there any GBB with bolt-lock or do they all have bolt-lock and bolt release? (anwsered: yes 99% of GBB are bolt lock and release)

99% of GBB's have block lock and a release. You can assume all GBBS are "realistic" in that aspect.

Most people just get their "GBB" needs from their side arm (pistol), while they run a primary AEG.

Maintenance is alright, you'll find a ton of videos on youtube. GBB are a lot more fun imo, but when shots can be inconsistent or not as accurate as an AEG that can be frustrating for many..

Another thing is I have a indoor facility close by so I can switch to CQB during the winter and use GBB all year round.
But... skirmishing off against AEGs with high caps in the bush and people that spray and pray would suck so really GBBs are only good for milsim games, during the winter indoor CQB or games where ammo is locked.
So that said at least with a ERG I have more options in terms of type of gameplay and competitiveness with other AEG's.

So looks like I am leaning towards the KWA RM4 ERG as my first rifle.
As much as I like the realism of GBBRs a ERG is just more versatile and adding that extra OPTIONAL of bolt-lock with 30/60rd mags or no bolt-lock with high cap mags. With a bit of a recoil kick that can be customizable to add more of a kick.

I have a KWA RM4 ERG that has been upgraded with a new inner barrel, flat-hopped. I also swapped out the handguard for a free-float rail system.

I absolutely love this gun. I use it exclusively as my main gun. The quick change spring allows me to change my FPS in less than 3 minutes. Just need a good castle nut wrench and you're good to go.

This is exactly what I needed to hear thank you. Looks like I'm in the market for a KWA RM4 ERG.

Here's a photo of mine. The receiver is pretty beat up as I'm pretty rough with my guns when playing. This rifle holds up really well to my abuse. I can't tell you how many times I've dropped it, by accident, onto concrete.

http://i.imgur.com/fLW0UkG.jpg

Awesome I wanna do something like that with my rail down the line.
How accurate and effective is it at long range?
Like if you wanted to switch to a scope and play more long range.

I can definitely reach out and touch people with the hop-up set right. Just get a really nice barrel with a flat-hopped bucking or even an R-hop if you don't mind putting in the work.

Also, I had to remove my fuse box because it was giving me a lot of trouble with this rail. I'm not saying a recommend doing this, but if you're smart with your wiring and you don't hold down your trigger to try to clear a jam, you're good to go. That said, I've never had a jam, and my wiring is protected with airline tubing and properly shrink-wrapped, so in the rare event that my quick detach wiring ever comes loose, there is no way they would short.

Where is a good place to get one in Canada? Doesn't seem any of my local shops carry any so I am going to have to order it from some online Canadian retailer.

To solve the unsettled dispute of which EBB kicks the most, I bought and own every single EBB M4 you mentioned as we speak. In terms of recoil, if any, the ranking of mine is:

ERG with ULYSSES recoil control weight installed > LONEX EBB with BO DYNAMICS branding > BOLT EBB (I got 2 of the new version called HEAVY RECOIL) > stock ERG > LONEX EBB with own branding and the recoil kit is sold separately (don't buy it, You will regret it unless your standard isn't high) > Marui EBB M4

If you don't mind my post in mandarin, see the link for more pics, all are my EBBs.

http://www.arms-cool.net/forum/thread-175550-1-2.html

Here is link of the review on the ULYSSES kit, every ERG owner should try it. The felt recoil has been increased a whole lot. The recoil kicks crisp and straight right back to your shoulder, not just shaking back and forth like BOLT. BOLT, however, shakes your shoulder more in other people's eyes and it also will "bounce" your red dot the most if a reflex sight is being used.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMtvJTuC5-s

This is my newest build for ERG, I hate to see a battery box on my beautiful rail, so all my ERGs are rear wired, and yes, it's so hard to find one now probably because I bought all of them last few months (rear wired ones). I heard there will be a huge restock in Jan.

https://i.imgur.com/KGQgpOV.jpg

I'm waiting for BOLT MB5 SWAT to arrive at Canada, I will keep you posted to see if it's the new king of RECOIL among EBBs.

Where do you buy the ULYSSES kit?

Where did you get the ULYSSES kit?! I've been wanting one of these real bad. Just could not figure out how to get one into Canada.

Love the recoil on the KWA M4 ERG. I actually tried this gun and the TM HK416 the same day and I was amazed at how much kick both guns had.

This was two Nightfalls ago a very friendly generous player from the Green team was chronoing his gun and allowed me to test fire the gun. One of my team mates was rocking the KWA ERG. After trying both I knew I had to get one.

But many people advised me not to get the KWA due to proprietary parts but after getting the gun and having pretty good past experience with KWA Customer Service I'm at ease knowing at least I can fix my gun if something goes wrong.

I've put in all the upgrades I wanted into the ERG. Internals and gearbox are quit beefy. I was surprised to be honest and I also own G&P, King Arms and VFC guns.

Take down of the gun and getting into the internals weren't difficult at all.

Installed myself a new Rail, R-Hopped Inner Barrel, and a LYNX Mosfet.

Things I really like about the KWA ERG compared to the rest of the guns I've owned.

The magwell seems to accept all my magazines without any issues or modifications. I absolutely LOVE that!! No shimming no taping no velcro!!! No misfeeding!!!!

Trigger on the gun feels very very nice. There is this sort of soft feeling the trigger has which has nice feedback but allows for quick and easy trigger pulls on semi.

There are two minor issue which doesn't bother me much about the gun. The paint job comes off quit easily and is prone to scratching.

My PTS ERG is front wired making battery options limited if you like aesthetics like me.

Everything else about the gun feels very solid.

How do you like having a mosfet on the ERG? Do you lose functionality of the bolt-lock?

I actually never used the bolt lock feature. I use 120round magazines. KWA comes with a 30/60 round magazine.

The LYNX is a very basic and tiny mosfet. I've only installed it to protect my trigger contacts from burning up. I assume the bolt lock functionality would not be affected.

After my VFC trigger contacts burnt up after three games all my guns have mosfets. Its piece of mind knowing at least you have one less thing to worry about.

I have the Fortis Rail installed and there is plenty of room for the LYNX inside the hand guard.

Oh I see. I've been using my RM4 for over half a year now "unprotected." I've never considered a mosfet, up until recently, as I haven't yet heard of any reports of contact burn out. You're literally the second person I've heard of installing a mosfet and now I'm thinking if I should get one too.

Also, I exclusively use the 30/60 PMAGS now as I really like the bolt lock feature. I ended up buying a ton of these and I'm probably going to consider selling off my PTS EPMs since I never really use them anymore.

I got them from GMARKET, it's a rare Korean website which is English friendly. They will buy it locally for you and ship out to your country. Expensive though, and you will lose some FPS with the kit installed. My ERG now only shoots 330fps (0.25 g) now.

That FPS would not bother me in the slightest. How much did it end up costing you for one of these kits, if you don't mind me asking?

A mosfet is definitely something to consider if your running 11v lipo. I think that's what did it for me when my VFC's trigger contacts burnt up.

I know I said earlier that all my AEGs have mosfets installed but the one gun that doesn't is my King Arms M4 loaner. Its a forgettable gun but pretty reliable though. No issues with it so far.

The Extreme Fire's LYNX specs are quit good for what you pay for. I think its what 25$ USD for one and its the size of a quarter. Its not going to break the bank :)

I also have a few Gates NanoASR

I'd opt for the LYNX over the Gates NanoASR any day though.

http://extreme-fire.com/2011-SW-LYNX.html

Roughly 150 CAD after tax, duty, and shipping. Personally I think it worths the money, but still, it was not cheap.

Okay after seeing your review I'm actually quit interested.

When you said the increase in recoil was a lot could you put a number to it? Example like 25% more? 50% more?

I am having a hell of a time finding KWA RM4A1 in Canada.
http://triggerairsoft.com/ had the KWA RM4A1 on their site yesterday for $375 but now they took it off their site =\
Looks like if I buy it from the USA ill be paying around $420 - $430 at least.

I paid 599$ tax shipping included for my PTS ERG about two years ago on airsoftstore.ca

If you guys are finding it for 375$ that is amazing!

No, I am referring to the non PTS version.
It's a bit newer than the PTS KWA ERGs. It's called the KWA RM4A1 ERG.
It has the battery in the stock.

Can't find it in any Canadian shops anymore. I do see the KSC M4A1 Carbine ERG, does anyone have any opinions on that one?

Newer model and much cheaper just blows my mind

I think it's because it doesn't have any magpul parts.

Thats true
Though the rear wiring does make battery options a hell of a lot easier.

I'm still having huge problems finding batteries for my PEQ
Ones I had have fattened up

I went through the same thing too and I had to weigh my options. I considered the PTS EPF foregrip with the battery storage, but I hate vertical grips. I considered rear wiring it, but I prefer the option of lower profile stocks like the MOE or the MFT BMS. The PEQ, while also obtrusive, was the only option that fit closest to my ergonomic requirements.

Just wish there was an alternative to this as I prefer my rifle to look as clean and simple as possible.

Aesthetics is always number one for me. The gun has to look pretty. I'm okay with the PEQ battery box as long as it is pretty and hides all the wires lol.

That said though my alternative at the moment is to use a battery bag until I can find proper sized batteries

Yes I also considered some sort of battery bag as I have a bunch of candy bar lipos just sitting around when I used to use them in the MOE handguard.

Currently the wiring coming out of my PEQ box and rail and very neatly shrink wrapped. I'm a stickler for wire management and keeping them as tucked away as possible, unseen.

Felt like sharing :)

http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...psyhlbxssr.jpg

http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/...pshopnywv5.jpg

^ Pretty bad ass, looks great with the PEQ.

With the other guys sharing as well I just had to share mine too :)

Damn that is really nice looking. I'm going to take some new snaps of mine. We should really start an ERG thread of something.

Here are some quick and dirty snapshots of mine in its current configuration.

http://i.imgur.com/daklgtg.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/MuY28Ou.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/XxsmMqW.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/50sXJMu.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/xnbaB4I.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RYk91C7.jpg

Wow beautiful!

Its funny both of ours are almost identical with the only difference is yours having a longer barrel and different rail. Everything else almost the same.

The flash hider is quit nice on yours.

If you look at mine closely you can see the wires and the mosfet due to the big vents on the Fortis Rail.
I don't mind it too much but I know for some they just want those wires hidden

Literally just just put that flash hider on last night. Not sure how I feel about it. Makes my barrel look a little too long and it's already 1/2" longer than a standard M4 without it because I had to put and small extension on it to clear my inner barrel. I'm considering cutting and crowning my inner barrel, but all it will do is save me half an inch. It also makes the balance of my rifle a little front heavy with it being steel as opposed to my old featherweight aluminium one.

Do what I did and cover all you visible wires and plugs with large pieces of heat shrink tubing. It really helps to hide it all. I also have my wires shortened to what I'd foreseeably need.

In one of my pictures, you can see a little bit of red wire. I left it like that intentionally so that I could see if my bullet connectors ever came loose. I have them protected with clear airline tubing so they can never short if you ever manage to get pulled while a battery is plugged in.

Better looking than the stock birdcage flash hider. It adds a nice unique look to the gun.

But I get you about the length and balance of the gun. My secondary focus when building a gun is weight and size. The smaller and lighter makes gaming those long hot hours much easier :)

You have a gun that isn't balanced its just going to make playing more annoying. That's one reason why I added the Silencer on my KAC PDW give it a bit more balance.

Would you happen to have an extra one you want to get rid of? :)

Haha, sorry man. I'm even thinking about getting another set for DMR setting...

Btw, my bro and I bought the last two rear wired ERGs from b2airsoft under 400 CAD, now they are out. I guess it is much cheaper without the Magpul branding on the rifle.

The felt recoil does increase a lot, I'd say 30%, but it is so subjective. I like the enhanced recoil not because it shakes way more - it kicks staight back to the shoulder now and the prompt, explosive energy you feel the exact second you break the trigger, much like a short-stroked GBB.

Some collections of my EBBs:


My favorite ERG, it molds into my hands. I don't know, when I shoot with it, it just feels right. I love the ROMEO sight by Sig Sauer too. Auto on and off with motion activated function, never failed.

https://i.imgur.com/kEIB5pw.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/tzA8qMD.jpg



Lonex EBB with BO DYNIMICS branding, probably a rare one found in Canada, the crisp recoil is heaven-like. Some people thought it's GBB with only 2 meters away!

https://i.imgur.com/Vo4KqWM.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/R6AQlzS.jpg



Lonex EBB with own branding. This one is the polymer version. The trigger response is of course great because I installed the mosfet, but I would not suggest you to use mosfet on any given EBB with simulated recoil. For some reason, it will take away the felt recoil greatly.

https://i.imgur.com/FyFaCXR.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/bRcO2FO.jpg



Another LONEX EBB with own branding. This one is full metal version though. The recoil is even worse. Don't buy it. The recoil kit was sold separately, so I'd suggest just go with the ERG unless you can find the BO DYNAMICS version. Don't even try HEROOUTDOORS, I bought their last one!

https://i.imgur.com/LX9mB6w.jpg



BOLT "HEAVY" BRSS, good shaking momentum, but you will feel the recoil coming from the lower receiver, not the tube. Strange feeling when shooting semi, but with burst? Man, the Eotech reticle will almost bounce out of your sight! The barrel will literally dance up and down, so your weak hand will enjoy the recoil more than your strong hand - I told you it's weird, didn't I? I would say it gives the most satisfying experience with burst mode out of all my EBBs.

https://i.imgur.com/SLcrY0z.jpg



ERG again, trying to go back to an old-school look, but clearly I failed. Still can't get rid of the reeks of poor tacticool attempts.

https://i.imgur.com/Lzlgq9v.jpg



Sorry it's ERG again. This one is very light weight and super comfortable to grip. Got no battery box to block your field of view, and the stock is not bulky either. Good balance to hold, very easy to point and aim when switch among multiple targets. Accurate by design because of the simple mod I did for the inner and outer barrel. Just love it. The Inforce flashlight is a must have! Go with the newest version though - they fixed the cracking problems and now it is built to last! I got the 700 lumin one with NV compatibility. Don't try to turn it on when you got mirrors around, the reflection of the beam kept me blind for a few seconds! The M-lok rail handguard is very very slim and low profile. It also allows me to mount the Inforce light with 45 degree angle without the need to mount a bulky offset rail first, good buy!

https://i.imgur.com/KGQgpOV.jpg



BOLT HEAVY BRSS KNIGHT URX 3.1, beautiful piece, pictures coming soon.

Okay yhaa I get what your saying. Very nice description of the recoil. I really want to try it out and see for my self lol.

I just realized why I like the ERG so much. You get some sort of feedback letting you know you fired off at least one bullet.

I'm particularly picky with my GBB Pistols. I love pistols that kick nice and hard its so satisfying. I've gotten rid of several pistols in my collection that had very weak kick. KSC G17 I'm looking at you!

Question you ever compared 7v and 11v batteries?

I find with the 7v batteries the recoil is a bit heavier due to the slower ROF.
11v I find too quick and vibrates a lot more.

Is that the stock rails that come with the new ERG?

Edit: Took a closer look looks like a madbull DD rail?
I have the OMEGA Rail on my G&P Magpul M4

You got that right, 7.4V does make you feel the recoil more, but not very practical in combat. I usually go with 11.1v 15C. I'd go with 9.6 Nimh for the best result but it's kinda out of date.

The same reason I love ERG so much for its bolt stop function! It adds the realism and fun (or should I say pleasant pressure?) Don't forget to hit the bolt release after changing the mag! I still forgot to do it sometimes and just pulled the trigger with no response, then the f word coming from my mouth...

Strangely, this awkward moment never happened when I was using GBBRs, I guess that's because the last shot emptied by GBBR actually sounds and feels different, and that's the cue for me to change mags, and rock the bolt right back to where it belongs. Getting familiar to different systems or platforms is also part of the game I enjoy (well, sometimes).

And yes, that is DD rail by madbull, good eyes!

any experience with Tremors recoil kit ?

Believe it or not, I got first-hand experience from the beginning of its R&D process back in 2010-2011. Modify was working with a guy called Tiger who I was quite familiar with. Tried the kit on G&G polymer M4 and CA EBB M4. I tried them for field combat tests. It worked ok but don't even think it would survive the torture test. But that was done in Taiwan where the standard was so much higher than it is in North America. FPS of 500 was pretty common (not sniper setting!), and the stock guns before tunings or upgrades are at least above 400. Semi auto was rarely used, not even burst. ROF of 28-32 was easily done and found necessary for valid kills.

Not recommended. The optimal spring to use is M130 and the ROF can't exceed 13. Your problem will not be the piston or gears, it's gonna be the bearings. Only ceramic Ball bearings can hold over 10,000 rounds and regular one-piece bearings will do harm to the gearbox shell.

Practical as in with the lower rate of fire?
If that is the case I shoot semi most of the time.
R-Hop :)

Man, that sounds sweet!

You gotta remember that your semi-auto trigger response will be slower too. Won't feel as snappy as the 11.1v.

Honestly it is. When I R-hopped my first gun I never knew how good it was. I had my G&P Magpul M4 at a game which was shooting under 350fps and a buddy of mine asked me if he could compare my R-Hop to his Flat Hop.

He was running a polar star shooting under 400fps using 0.3g with his flat hop.
I asked to use his BBs because I was runing 0.25g.

OMG when we did the test my gun was shooting further than his and it was shooting about 50fps lower.

So that day I knew if your going to put any performance upgrade at all in your gun... it better be an R-Hop. That and run only 0.3g BBs or heavier :)


Yhaa thats true. I do recall situations where I wish I was a tad faster lol

I'm considering to rear-wire my PTS erg. Kind of want to go for a cleaner look without the PEQ box. Anybody have any info one the best way to do this? I might email KWA to see if I can order an RM4A1 buffer tube.

What kind of gearbox upgrades have you guys done to your RM4s, if any? I have my gearbox cracked open right now because I'm rewiring it to the rear and I'm considering to replace the piston head to a ported one and probably change out the trigger to a flat one.

None at all. The RM4's Gearbox and internals seem to be pretty beefed up compared to other brands.

If it ain't broke don't fix it :)

However I do know guys who have upgraded the motor on their RM4s though.

I never felt the need to do it. Then again I'm not all too fussed about having a high ROF either or having a really quick trigger response.

btw can you snap of photos of your rear wiring work? I maybe interested in doing it myself :)

Yeah I've never felt needing anything more. I've been pretty happy with the performance with this gun. I just felt the piston head looks a bitch sketchy when I inspected it. I'm actually thinking about installing a mosfet while I'm at it.

This is the stage I'm at right now:
http://i.imgur.com/OLZQ1lW.jpg

Already have a clear idea of how I will route it to the rear. Just have to replace one of the trigger contact leads with longer wire. The receiver and sling plate will need a slight amount of filing for the wires to move freely.

KWA emailed me back about the RM4A1 buffer tube assembly and they said they will try to make it available for purchase in the next few days or so. For now, I'm just going to have it so that the wires will have to be very slightly visible coming out of the receiver and into the stock I will use.

I decided to take my time with this little project. I'm considering to paint my receivers while I'm at it. Should be done by the weekend. Will update with pics.

Keep us updated with this build. Is there a price on the buffer tube? Interested in rear wiring my gun as well.

Only gripe I have is that I love the Magpul CRT stock. I know I'll need to get me a crane.

No idea but I'm guessing it will be around $20 USD considering they sell standard AEG tubes for about that much. I'm willing to wager that shipping will be astronomical for it ($47 flat rate for larger items), but I'm going to see if I can get them to lower it for me. If not, I've got some ideas to hide the wire without the that buffer tube. Won't be as clean, but will be barely noticeable.

As for the CTR stock, there is another one called the STR. Same general design as the CTR but with crane style wings around the cheek weld. I'm sure you could cram a nunchuck into those.

shelcoof: Are you able to record a quick clip of your firing your gun? I'm still debating about getting a mosfet and I'm curious how the trigger response is with the ERG. If you can't, it's all good.

I could have it posted later tonight when I free up some time.

Just a note though I'm using the Extreme Fire LYNX on my RM4. I know I've said this before but I'm going to say this again I own both the Nano ASR and the Extreme Fire LYNX.

I've installed the Nano ASR on my VFC KAC PDW and have swapped it out for an Extreme Fire LYNX so the mosfet could fit inside the rails.

I found there was a significant improvement of the ROF and trigger response when switching to the LYNX.

Performance with the Nano ASR the gun felt like it was chugging with a 7v lipo.

My VFC is pretty much stock gearbox with the stock Black VFC Motor.

So keep this in mind when watching the video. :)


https://youtu.be/x1jlXgfEaVg

https://youtu.be/2jnEHbCE6Vo

^Oh man you actually posted the videos! I don't know how this completely slipped past me. Thank you!

I'm almost done with my rear-wiring build. Will be posting the progress photos of the actual job after I'm done. This is very doable as long as you are willing to put in the work and planning.

Anyways here is a teaser photo. I got bored of black and decided to give it a little paint job.

http://i.imgur.com/2CPv0sG.jpg

The paint job still looks black in the photo lol but it does look a lot shinier :)

I actually found a video I did of the ROF with the Gates NANO ASR that was not published on my channel

https://youtu.be/Q-Kct0oNWgc

I couldn't believe how low the ROF was on the VFC KAC PDW with a 7v battery so I did up the video to show a Friend who is the local Gun Tech in our area.

Oh jeez I hope this isn't another one of those "white and gold dress" optical fiascoes. It's like a metallic DD style FDE or burnt bronze finish. Should be more apparently when I have the gun fully assembled to contrast with the black furniture.

Your ERG does seem to be a snappier than stock. I can't put in a mosfet at this time though because the stock I used only has just enough room for a PEQ sized battery and the wiring. I could probably make a little more room with a dremel in the future, but right now I just want to finish this gun. Might end up throwing in a ported piston head, last minute, as a placebo of efficiency to myself.

7.4v seems to be super slow in the VFC even by stock standards. I wonder why.

I can dig that sort of bronz look. Before I got the ERG I actually wanted a VFC Platinum Grey. Loved the look shame no retailers had it at the time. But it was okay.. I got me the ERG instead lol

ERG snappier? Maybe its the motor height? Shim job? But to be honest I did nothing to the Gearbox... I did check the shims but it all seemed to mesh really well already so I left it alone.

Yhaa once I replaced the NANO ASR with the LYNX the ROF went back to a good rate with the 7v lipo.

Hello
I posted thread about homemade EBB for AEG, unfortunately I don't have M4, but I did EBB for all AEG currently I have (AK, MP40, MP44 and M14), you can get ideas from my post

My PTS RM4 rear-wire is finally alive!

Super interested in the process, any chance you could make a tutorial thread and post it up one day?

I will post all of the progress photos, in a thread, of how I did it probably tomorrow (I am so tired right now from this). I spent about a week working on this gun, seemingly non-stop. It wasn't the easiest thing to do and requires tons of planning and figuring out how to get a wire out of the back of the gun and into a stock while keeping it looking really clean. I also ended up reshimming the gears, changing out the piston head, swapping in a new motor, and replacing all of the stock wiring while I was at it. This was actually super fulfilling project and I'm pretty proud of what I did with this gun.

Update new KWA ERG's!
 

KWA VM4A1 - AEG2.5 platform (is this an ERG?)
KWA RM4A1 - AEG3 platform
PTS CA C40 - AEG3 platform

I would love to hear anyones thoughts on these ergs.

What else do you really need to know? It's been 3 months since you made this thread lol.

Pick an ERG and don't look back. There will always be "better ones" -but if that's your mentality, you'll be waiting forever.

Your safest bet would be the RM4A1 ERG

I have the RM4A1 thanks to you guys, I fckn love it.
I am just interested in the new guns tech.
Also just trying to consolidate erg information for other people searching for one.

AEG3 is the new "ERG" classification. The AEG2.5 has all the last-round cut-off features and compatible with ERG mags, just without the recoil engine. They are also releasing 30/120rd magazines with the extended followers and cut-off levers.