Appropriate gun for 12 year old
 

I have read the FAQs and all the pages regarding age verification but didn't see very much in regards to minors using these guns except that one can't be age verified until they are 18 and in most cases, games are restricted to those over 18. I also realize that many places will only sell airsoft guns to folks over 18.

Is it very common for 12 year olds to have/use these guns in Alberta, specifically the ICS GSG 522 Semi and Fully Automatic Airsoft Assault Rifle?

I am still confused as to the age verification requirements. Can the ICS GSG 522 be used anywhere in Alberta without the child or parent being AV'ed? If so, where can such a gun be legally used? Ie, public vs private property, or airsoft game sites only?

I have read that airsoft guns such as the ICS GSG 522 are not allowed to be purchased/owned/used by minors in Ontario. Is this currently correct?

Thanks for your help.

Not going to touch a lot of that, but one thing I will say is that, technically, firing an airsoft gun is illegal anywhere within any city limits, except at a designated range or field.

Typically there is a reason for a law, and in this case it should be fairly self-evident that an airsoft gun in the hands of a 12 year-old can be a very dangerous thing. Police have shot and killed people seen walking around with these things out in the open, and the airsoft gun itself is capable of causing serious bodily harm, such as puncturing a human eyeball.

Never in public, not even transporting them. They are still considered firearms and should be treated as such. Now if a parent wanted to purchase one for thier child and let them use it on private land that's up for debate I suppose. However an adult should always be present when they are.

I'm new here but here is what I figure it is in a nutshell..the age age verification is essentially a forum specific program set up and enforced so that minors cannot purchase these airsoft guns from this site thus eliminating the liability of this site from any reprocussions if a child purchased a gun and say took it out on the street and well...for instance was shot by a police officer because when the officer demanded he drop said gun he didnt cause its " just a toy".

Airsoft guns are dangerous and look real enough that minors shouldn't have access to them at all as far as I am concerned....with all that said thats just my opinion

Where are you located in AB? you know it doesn't help if you're super vague. You could be in Calgary, Ft Mac, GP, Claresholm, or Milk River for all we know.

Kids can't own these guns or be gifted them period (at least in Ontario because it's specifically spelled out in the Provincial statutes, other provinces may have different wordings or different statutes). They are the property of the supervising adult and the adult takes responsibility for any use/misuse.

I know AB is more gun friendly especially for kids in the boonies and on farms who varmint hunt with .22's and stuff. There's no reason why you can't use it but you should do so under direct parent supervision.

When I was 12 I had my own real firearms. I did not get to tote them about at will though.

Without personally knowing the child in question there is no easy answer. If you want something they can keep in their room and use at will get them a Nerf gun. They can use it in house, shoot their friends, and so on.

I suspect you've got your kid bending your ear explaining they need to buy that ICS and at the end of the day it's up to you to decide. If they attend organized games supervised by adults at an established venue, then the answer is maybe.

If they want it so the can tuck it in a gym bag and use it in the park, etc. then chances are high this will end badly.

Anything in between the two will probably end badly also.

Theres nothing to say expect "too bad" I wanted to buy a p90 from a retailer when I was 16. I didn't buy it until I was 18.
"too bad, so sad"

Airsoft is made 18+ for a reason. those who choose give guns to someone that is not 18 or older is doing something every every harmful to the communities they live in.

best idea is to wait and better things will happen in the future years to come

That's some very peculiar and strangely worded questions.

Disregarding what the above(GBBR) says.

What does your son plan to do with it? Ask him talk with him. Heck make him make a little presentation with maybe a slide show or a display of local (read nearby) airsoft stuff. Can he find places to play safely? Does he understand he will require equipment to protect himself from injury. Does he understand he must follow rules and play fairly?

Is your child even tempered? Will he bring it to school? Or tell friends he has a gun at home? All of these things can be harmful. And that's just a tip of the iceberg. Does he understand that a police officer can shot him with a real gun if he brandished the airsoft in public?

Ask him and yourself these questions .

Wait till your kids are 12.

I'm not trying to discredit your post. but seriously shit happens sometimes.

Its completely different if you are going to get the gun and let your kid use it in games and such. There is a guy who brings a 7 year old to sgt splatters, that kid is a great player too, but he doesn't own any of the guns he uses.

Using the gun under adult supervision is cool
someone under 18, owning a gun is... well

I think the "interview" thing would be an appropriate precaution to take before allowing the child to PLAY airsoft.

Under "direct" adult supervision with consent from a "legal guardian" a child can operate (not own) an airsoft gun, firearm, whatever; as long as the instrument is legal to own/operate in Canada, and is being used in legal manner, at legal facility that encompasses all federal, provincial, and municipal laws, legislation, and by-laws. A child however cannot legally take responsibility for themselves, and therefore cannot shoot a projectile at another human being. Make sense? Make sure that while you child is operating an airsoft in a legal place under close supervision, that they are wearing appropriate eyewear.

Thing is we don't know if he's a farm kid from out in the sticks or a 12 year old COD playing screeching city slicker. That said, Styrak is onto something, very peculiar and strangely worded questions....

I'm betting it's a city kid because farm kids have 0 fucks to give and varmint hunt all the time (or so I'm told, but they also do field work and chop trees and what not). Plus don't have to worry about city bylaws because they're outside city limits and are allowed to shoot on their property and know it.

Now that I re-read the original post, it is quite odd; nice catch Styrak. Obviously you have that particular gun in mind for some reason. I'm assuming it's because you already have it, it's whats available from a local retailer, or you think you can obtain one? I will say this; any illegal activity which involves the use of an airsoft gun will be treated as a full firearms offense. Whoever you are please double check all your local by-laws before doing anything. You have something in mind, just make sure it's perfectly legal. Always remember safety comes first, and people's feelings are ...not on the list.

If it was a kid that lived in "buttfuck no where" wouldnt he have a pellet gun, like a red ryder? LOL ussually an airsoft gun is intended use is well, as stupid as it sounds, to shoot people :P

C'mon we already have so many examples of kids making poor decision.
have a look at the "ehobby canada" thread.

It is our job as airsofters to prevent these things from happening, whether it be a kid selling airsoft, a kid doing something stupid with an airsoft gun, or a kid gaming unsafely at a feild.

Close. It's our job to set good examples, and to mentor as much as possible. We are not airsoft police, just the head of the national community. Luckily though, the real police are just a 9-1-1 away. Feel free to call when said dumbasses are seen doing something illegal or unsafe; and not just for airsoft guns. Lol!

You guys are way off base. The OP is a parent posting the question.

Their kid has come to them with a pig in a poke, or in this case a ICS GSG 522 that they want and must have.

The parent knows nothing about airsoft and is now fact checking to see if "all the other kids have these dad", and "everyone is doing it", and etc.

You guys with kids; it will happen to you too. Maybe not an airsoft gun but a cellphone or a pony or a game console. I can spot that particular sales method a mile off and you'll learn do it too.

Spot on, that was me at 12.

I don't believe a kid that young needs an AEG to go blasting in his back yard at some targets. If he's looking for something to plink with there are plenty of spring action airsoft guns you can buy at Walmart or CanTire, most of which do not look real, some of which have a "realistic" look to them. When I was that young my dad ran into the same issue with me. He bought me a cheap G36 spring action rifle that I would lay in the grass in my FENCED backyard and shoot targets with, and always under supervision. If he is simply looking to get them to play with his friends or shoot at them for shits and giggles; educate the boy about proper safety and that ultimately these are meant for that in safe settings only, only get him a springer, and make sure you don't let him keep it in his room, regardless if it's a spring gun or AEG. I was 12 once, I know what I used to do with dad's BB guns, airsoft guns and real steels when he wasn't around (this is of course after I found the keys to his cases). Last thing you want is little Jimmy at your door with his father, furious because your boy shot Jimmy at point blank range in the eye with a "clearsoft" pistol/shotgun/rifle.

This is of course simply subjective and only my opinion. This does not work with everyone. Good luck and good day.

We have a whole league of under 16 airsofters in winnipeg. They're more fun to play with than most people I used to play with lol
The woman that runs it is extremely strict with rules, so it's an excellent club for weeding out the dangerous kids.
Instead of turning a blind eyes to kids with guns, we gave them places to play, endorsed their team, and even help train them.
They're gonna play with guns anyway, it might as well be in a controlled and supervised environment lol


Anyway good gun would be a pdw. Full size parts and compatibility, but it's just a naturally scaled down M4, or a 552

Appropriate gun for a 12 year old... NERF

they don't look like real guns.. and even the most irresponsible misuse won't hurt anyone.


anything else, Pellet , AS would need to be under the direct supervision of an adult.

of course there are differences in expected indoctrination to guns between urban vs rural location.

At the end of the day.. the parent decides what is right for their kid, and also takes responsibility for all uses, intended or otherwise. Frankly it's no one else's business.

Oh really now? The Japanese, the creators of airsoft, must have it all wrong, considering they specifically have made airsoft models over the years to target the pre-teen/early teen age groups.

Mind you, I guess Airsoft is just that much more dangerous then a kid legally going hunting at 16 in Ontario without needing a adult beside them with a real rifle in the bush? :rolleyes:

Seriously Danke is perfectly spot on in his two posts. Yes 12 is young, but hell I had a "arsenal" of pellet guns at that age, and the only key to the trigger lock of one of my father's hunting rifles, which is currently sitting in my own firearm safe since I got my PAL.

It is 100% dependant on the kid, but without (insert Pellet Gun, Airsoft etc here), and the father teaching his son how to be responsible with them, the kid will never grow up to be responsible on his own with anything remotely related to firearms.

Dimitri

underage and increased risk
 

No,LAWFULLY means no,boys and girls,MUST abide by the 18+ law..It will give the airsoft community a bad rap,so parents,teach your child about "guns" in general with a water pistol!

I’m sorry if I sounded vague in my original post about the appropriateness of an ICS GSG 522 for a 12 year old. Nothing strange about my intentions. I am the uncle of the boy in question and I didn’t want to litter this forum with details of family dirty laundry. My nephew is severely ADHD which is not adequately controlled with medication and has all the impulsiveness that comes with the condition. My nephew is also a big city boy but occasionally travels to an isolated community in Alberta where he would use the gun. He has never been around guns before except for water pistols and a Nerf gun. It was not my nephew who wants this gun (he didn’t know about them either) but his father who wants to get him one. His mother is dead set against it. That’s the dirty laundry I was telling you about.

I myself know nothing about airsoft guns and had never heard of them until a few days ago so just wanted to get feedback from experts who are familiar with them. After researching them on the Internet and finding this site, my gut feel is my nephew owning or using one of these devices is a disaster waiting to happen – for him and for others. I just wanted to know if I was over reacting and being unreasonable or if it is commonly accepted practice for 12 years to own/use these. Thanks for your responses so far!!

I think your gut feeling is correct on this. The good people who moderate and run this forum expend a non-trivial portion of their time and effort in protecting airsoft from disasters like the one you fear. The non-lethality of airsoft guns seems to suggest to many parents that these are toys and appropriate for kids. The respect for their status as firearms is therefore lacking, and this isn't limited to kids -- many of us adults who got into this stuff late assumed they were toys when we first discovered them. I know I did. A bit of bad luck could have led to some serious misunderstandings had I not done some research.

IMHO, it should not belong to the boy but belong solely to you until he is of age and can demonstrate to you the basics in firearms safety. Until then I'd suggest/recommend that he is never allowed use of the weapon with out you or direct supervision of his parents. You could go as far as getting a trigger lock that you carry the key on your person.

Get them a real gun first, teaches them a lot more respect and discipline that way. Getting used to a stick that goes pew pew can make it easy to forget the difference in danger levels between an empty airsoft gun and an empty firearm. If they only know the outcome of pulling the trigger on an airsoft gun, they can be much more likely not to realize just how serious handling a real gun is. I'm not saying everyone who airsofts must shoot real steel, but a someone who only knows airsoft can bring dangerous habits over to RS. If the parent or guardian supervising doesn't have an understanding of these devices, the kid won't be likely to learn on their own.

Just my 2 cents.

Please link me to this "18+ law" you speak of? Canada wide? Seeing as how a 16 year old can shoot a real rifle unsupervised...

You do realize this 18+ thing is a self regulated rule. Right?...

Pretty much. My suggestion would be to consider getting him a good quality, hobby grade RC car. Lots of fun can be had with those, and it's far more difficult to hurt someone with one. You can get pretty serious into racing, including competitive racing.

I used to work at a hobby shop and have seen parents come in with questions exactly like this.. Have a look at the Traxxas Slash, for example. Used to sell a loooooooot of those, and IMO it would be perfect for the child described.

Well at the end of the day the choice is up to the parents of said child. so far from asking everyone's opinion on the situation almost everyone opposes. I also oppose getting a 12 year old a gun, BUT however, if can prove himself responsible enough to the parents, there is nothing I, or anyone else on this forum that can do anything, besides you. Show his father this thread. Print it perhaps and highlight some key things. Highlight both for and against and have him read it.

??

Firearms safety starts as young as possible, so a disaster does not occur when something like an uneducated youth comes into contact with a firearm for the first time. Airsoft by it's nature is not "legally" eighteen plus. A child of any age can operate or discharge a firearm with adult supervision. There may be local laws that prevent the use or discharge of such a device by a youth. Retailers can't sell them, or anything dangerous to youth because the retailer cannot assume legal responsibilty for said youth. That "can" include anything from matches, knives, fireworks, power tools, etc. parents or legal guardians are ultimately responsible for the youth; as mentioned by Brian earlier. As long as due diligence, adequate supervision, and all laws are observed then a youth can use an airsoft gun.

The only back and forth grey area ends up with those under the age of majority shooting projectiles at others. Some argue that many children show maturity (true), and that they are capable of playing safe (also true), or all you need is adequate insurance (yikes). But once you put the ability to shoot others in the hands of a youth, how can a parent/guardian be activily responsible for how they shoot unless they are standing next to them as they play?

The important thing is that airsoft guns are dangerous. They look real and therefore can get you killed, or they can easily hurt others without care. As a parent/guardian these are things to consider when mixing youth and airsoft. If it's shooting your interested in I'd also suggest a real rifle. Start him off with proper gun safety and respect; airsoft does tend to bend these principles in people's minds. It's best to build a solid and safe foundation. You did the right thing by asking the community for help, I hope we were able to answer your questions.

It's easier to teach kids about gun safety than teenagers. True story.

Also, bad rep my ass. Kids have been playing airsoft in manitoba league for like 3 years now, and there's a LOT of them. Not only are they GOOD for the community since they bring up properly trained airsofters, but they're actually really fun to play with too. Consider the shape of the average airsofter on your own fields, how many of those people would you HAVE to run a mile around to flank because they're so active? lol
It's not the kids that are the problem, it's ignorant people who don't want to teach them about airsoft! If they didn't have a supervised and (strictly) controlled environment in which to play airsoft, I'm sure they'd be playing in the street with no eye protection.

^+1

In my opinion ADD/ADHD 99% of the time is a load of crap.

They don't teach boys how to focus their energy any more, with shooting, hunting, fishing, camping, scouts, building things, or what ever else boys have done for thousands of years.

It is easier for teachers to keep repeating the same lesson plans year after year, teaching kids in say Core French how to conjugate the same 3 verb endings year after year, or making every project a art project then it is to each new interesting stuff to kids.

So boys get bored, start not paying attention, acting up in class etc. And boys get branded as having a problem and needing to swallow pills as the only answer, to what is really society's fault not the kids.

Bet if you got that ICS and taught him to shoot under supervision, over time he'll calm a hell of a lot better then what ever drugs he is on. Boys need to grow, and society isn't growing boys up, its forgetting about them. Quite sad really.

Yup, like in York Region and now they "banned" airsoft in Markham over it.

Dimitri

You're wrong.

Different culture. Different values.
Japanese children don't spend hours and hours and hours after school playing video games, and those who do are the outcast shut-ins and THEY are a rarity compared to the rest.

Thanks, but try again.

Wooo how did ADD/ADHD come into the mix? No offence but people who don't have it do not understand. Heck I have a relatively mild case of ADD and I still cannot understand why people with more severe cases do what they do. Truthfully what has been said above about doing stuff like hunting, sports, building, reading, school work. All these things help the brain grow, learn and adjust to the chemical imbalance. Where as it is true medication will always help. The same medications will do wonders for people who don't suffer from it. I have been off my medication for 2 years and see no reason to go back on it. Does the medication still help? Hell yes. But it can help anyone who takes it. It's given to pilots, and college students want it to help them get better grades.

I think we should be very careful in not having this thread spill out into a big flamewar about ADD/ADHD, which are legitimate and medically-recognized behavioural disorders.

The original post was a pretty straightforward question about whether an airsoft gun would be appropriate for a 12 year old, particularly one who is showing signs of behavioural issues. We're not doctors, but it doesn't take a doctor to answer this question with "it depends, and whatever the answer is, it must be answered with care and with the safety of the child in mind". I think that for the OP's purposes, we've adequately raised the warning flags here.

A American study I just found (first on that came up on Google) say the average American high school aged (teens) boy plays 69 minutes a day on average.

((5*58) + (2*97)) / 7 = 69 minutes.

A Japanese study I found (also the first on that came up on Google), lists a average gaming time of 73 minutes, per day for teenage/high school boys.

((52.8 * 5) + (125.4*2) ) / 7 = 73 minutes.

You should try again. :rolleyes:

Dimitri

jacobean I wish I had a cool uncle like you growing up!

I can only speak for myself but I've got a cousin with ADHD and Aspergers syndrome. He is now older than 18 but still has the intellect of someone much younger. He's expressed interest in airsoft and had bought Canadian tire cr@p. I feel that its is an accident waiting to happen because of the lack of real responsibility and reason.

I can only echo the advice of people above in saying that your nephew is probably better off with nerf guns.

I have two nephews of my own 5 and 3. You would be surprised at the fun you can have with nerf and there's no chance of it being mistaken for a real firearm.

My humble 2 cents

Depends on the 12 year old really. I know a 12 year old that goes hunting with his dad with real firearms.

why is this still going on and why are you guys bringing other shit into the mix, other shit like airsoft in Japan. and how ADD or ADHD isnt a actauly thing and blah blah blah.

stick to the matter at hand. "is it a good idea for a child of 12 years old with add/adhd to own a airsoft gun?"

Answer is

No, because this 12 year old may not be responsible enough to own one because of his age, and he might not listen to an adult teaching him gun safety because of his condition.

Unless he learns proper safety procedures and also right from wrongs then I believe he can be permitted to use one under adult supervision. Owning one and letting him use it whenever he wants should not even be thought of. If the parent chooses to buy one for him to use under their supervision and have the replica locked away when the child is not permitted to use it is a different story.

Because this is non clearsoft replica it is difficult for police or people in general to know the differences between real and fake. If the child is allowed to do as he pleases something bad may happen. also becuase parents are liable for the childs in some cases, if the child does something stupid the parents could be or will be at fualt.

If it is a question of a 12 year old (or anyone under the age of 18, for that matter) playing airsoft, a good rule of thumb is, take the weapon he wants, and shoot him in the chest from 3-4 meters away. If he cries, then the answer is no.

If you are more concerned with the youth running down Main Street, waving it over his head, then it is more important to teach them to ALWAYS OBEY THE COMMANDS OF A POLICE OFFICER WHO IS POINTING A FIREARM AT YOU.

Lol I think that would borderline as abuse... pain isn't the issue and if it is then that should be a redflag right away. I skateboarded for 12 years, I can't imagine pushing kids down the stairs and smacking them in the shins with wood to test their pain tolerence and bone density would be socially tolerated.

I agree with the above poster that said something along the lines of NO person under the age of 18 should OWN a gun, using one under adult supervision with the permission of thier legal guardian would be fine though.
People need to remember that when someone hits the age of 18 there isn't an automatic download of firearm safety and responsibilities straight into their brain, these things need to be taught to by people willing and interested in lisenting... That takes genuine concern for safety and liability to do.

You cannot reasonably justify a minor who has had experience shooting real steel to be safe with airsoft because they are completely different things.

Everybody knows that a real steel rifle has the capability of killing people. Thus, unless you had a mental condition, any person would exercise extreme caution handling one. We all watch the movies, we all know what a (real) gun is capable of. Hell, even under the most sterile conditions with nobody around for miles, I'm still afraid of pulling the trigger. Minor or adult: this respect of "objects capable of killing easily" is embedded in each and everyone of us.

Whereas with airsoft - the things shoot plastic balls for fuck sakes. In the eyes of the misinformed, it is treated as a toy whether we like it or not. When an object is treated like a toy, any respect of it is thrown out the door and that explains why kids feel like bringing them out to parks and such. Unless our guns have the ability to seriously (and easily, don't try debating this) harm or kill people, they will be generally viewed and used as toys. Hell, even people actively on this forum (with all the safety rules and practices known) handle airsoft guns like toys.

So, no. Just, no. Your child is not qualified to (or should) be handing airsoft guns just because they have experience safely shooting real guns. They are different things entirely.

Nevermind the legal bull just plain common sense :

If it looks like a real one, treat it as such.

There have been problematic situations where a policemen drew his service weapon on minors going in the streets with these so imagine an instant that same policeman shot those kids, that could be your kid and that policeman could be an uncle stuck with that nightmare for the rest of his life.

There has been a story or two about 3 boys assaulting a girl in a park with those. She could have had an eye shot out because these things but luckly not. You need a safe and propper environnement for those like a paintball field or at the very least, a private field where there is no trespassing.

It's a good idea to look around and get info, most people dont and it just ends up crapping on the people like us that actually go the extra mile, literrally, and do the thing in a propper and safe manner.

So yes, minors could play with these safely but they require supervision at all time with facial protection and a propper controled area like paintball only.

Having a maximum limit of FPS for them is a good idea too in case the thing ends up out of you control for X reason. I suggest looking up airsoft related pictures of bb incidents.

In all honesty, I think these are toys for big boys only and should not be used by minors at all.

Here here

It takes a ''strong man'' to deny what's in front of him :rolleyes:

Wow this train derailed and took out the whole village.